Rings? You want to go with rings?
Joe DiMaggio and
Yogi Berra had twice as many. OK, it's twice as difficult to win a championship now so maybe their ten equate to Jeter's five. Counting championships is silly anyway.
Ernie Banks, Mr. Cub, who recently turned 80, never won no stinking ring. Banks switched from shortstop to first base in 1962. His home runs from 1955 through 1961: 44, 28, 43,
47, 45, 41, 29. Banks was National League MVP in 1958 and 1959 because he was a great hitting shortstop. Banks played 1,259 games at first and 1,125 at short, so he should be considered a first baseman. But Banks is in the Hall of Fame because of his great seasons as a shortstop.
Alex Rodriguez was also a great home run hitting shortstop. Rodriguez switched to third base when he was traded from Texas to the Yankees. Rodriguez has still played more games at short than at third: 1,272 to 1,189. Rodriguez had these home runs 1996 through 2003: 35 (also led in BA: .358), 23, 42, 42, 41,
52, 57, 47 (MVP).
Since Jeter is not a home run hitter we can skip that for him. Let's compare Jeter to Banks and Rodriguez on OPS+ when they played those seasons at shortstop. For Jeter, I'll start him in 1998 after he had 101 and 103 in his first two full seasons and take Jeter through 2005 so he will have a comparable number of consecutive seasons. After 2005 Jeter had these good years, which would not change his average:
2006 132
2007 121
2009 125
Banks | Rodriguez | Jeter |
144 | 161 | 127 |
136 | 120 | 153 |
149 | 136 | 128 |
155 | 134 | 124 |
156 | 163 | 111 |
146 | 160 | 125 |
123 | 158 | 114 |
| 147 | 125 |
144 | 147 | 126 |
Their averages are at the bottom.
When you hear about Jeter's rank among shortstops, consider both Banks and Rodriguez who may not be included in career comparisons.
As you go through this post think about this fundamental question: who is he better than? As a hitter, who is Derek Jeter better than? Who is the best hitter Jeter is better than?
Since 1969, playing at least 75% of games at shortstop, seasons OPS+ at least 150:
Rk |
Player |
OPS+ |
Year |
Age |
Tm |
Lg |
G |
PA |
AB |
R |
H |
2B |
3B |
HR |
RBI |
BB |
IBB |
SO |
HBP |
SH |
SF |
GDP |
SB |
CS |
BA |
OBP |
SLG |
OPS |
Pos |
1 |
Rico Petrocelli |
168 |
1969 |
26 |
BOS |
AL |
154 |
643 |
535 |
92 |
159 |
32 |
2 |
40 |
97 |
98 |
13 |
68 |
1 |
3 |
6 |
12 |
3 |
5 |
.297 |
.403 |
.589 |
.992 |
*6/5 |
2 |
Robin Yount |
166 |
1982 |
26 |
MIL |
AL |
156 |
704 |
635 |
129 |
210 |
46 |
12 |
29 |
114 |
54 |
2 |
63 |
1 |
4 |
10 |
19 |
14 |
3 |
.331 |
.379 |
.578 |
.957 |
*6/HD |
3 |
Alex Rodriguez |
163 |
2000 |
24 |
SEA |
AL |
148 |
672 |
554 |
134 |
175 |
34 |
2 |
41 |
132 |
100 |
5 |
121 |
7 |
0 |
11 |
10 |
15 |
4 |
.316 |
.420 |
.606 |
1.026 |
*6 |
4 |
Cal Ripken |
162 |
1991 |
30 |
BAL |
AL |
162 |
717 |
650 |
99 |
210 |
46 |
5 |
34 |
114 |
53 |
15 |
46 |
5 |
0 |
9 |
19 |
6 |
1 |
.323 |
.374 |
.566 |
.940 |
*6 |
5 |
Alex Rodriguez |
161 |
1996 |
20 |
SEA |
AL |
146 |
677 |
601 |
141 |
215 |
54 |
1 |
36 |
123 |
59 |
1 |
104 |
4 |
6 |
7 |
15 |
15 |
4 |
.358 |
.414 |
.631 |
1.045 |
*6/H |
6 |
Alex Rodriguez |
160 |
2001 |
25 |
TEX |
AL |
162 |
732 |
632 |
133 |
201 |
34 |
1 |
52 |
135 |
75 |
6 |
131 |
16 |
0 |
9 |
17 |
18 |
3 |
.318 |
.399 |
.622 |
1.021 |
*6/D |
7 |
Alex Rodriguez |
158 |
2002 |
26 |
TEX |
AL |
162 |
725 |
624 |
125 |
187 |
27 |
2 |
57 |
142 |
87 |
12 |
122 |
10 |
0 |
4 |
14 |
9 |
4 |
.300 |
.392 |
.623 |
1.015 |
*6/H |
8 |
Nomar Garciaparra |
156 |
2000 |
26 |
BOS |
AL |
140 |
599 |
529 |
104 |
197 |
51 |
3 |
21 |
96 |
61 |
20 |
50 |
2 |
0 |
7 |
8 |
5 |
2 |
.372 |
.434 |
.599 |
1.033 |
*6/HD |
9 |
Barry Larkin |
155 |
1996 |
32 |
CIN |
NL |
152 |
627 |
517 |
117 |
154 |
32 |
4 |
33 |
89 |
96 |
3 |
52 |
7 |
0 |
7 |
20 |
36 |
10 |
.298 |
.410 |
.567 |
.977 |
*6/H |
10 |
Alan Trammell |
155 |
1987 |
29 |
DET |
AL |
151 |
668 |
597 |
109 |
205 |
34 |
3 |
28 |
105 |
60 |
8 |
47 |
3 |
2 |
6 |
11 |
21 |
2 |
.343 |
.402 |
.551 |
.953 |
*6/H |
11 |
Derek Jeter |
153 |
1999 |
25 |
NYY |
AL |
158 |
739 |
627 |
134 |
219 |
37 |
9 |
24 |
102 |
91 |
5 |
116 |
12 |
3 |
6 |
12 |
19 |
8 |
.349 |
.438 |
.552 |
.989 |
*6 |
12 |
Nomar Garciaparra |
153 |
1999 |
25 |
BOS |
AL |
135 |
595 |
532 |
103 |
190 |
42 |
4 |
27 |
104 |
51 |
7 |
39 |
8 |
0 |
4 |
11 |
14 |
3 |
.357 |
.418 |
.603 |
1.022 |
*6/H |
13 |
Robin Yount |
150 |
1983 |
27 |
MIL |
AL |
149 |
662 |
578 |
102 |
178 |
42 |
10 |
17 |
80 |
72 |
6 |
58 |
3 |
1 |
8 |
11 |
12 |
5 |
.308 |
.383 |
.503 |
.886 |
*6/DH |
As demonstrated in the previous post Jeter's batting does not place him among the Yankee greats listed with their career OPS+ rank among all batters.
Derek Jeter announces his retirement after 2014 season and the slobbering is in full force on the Selig TV Network. Thursday, February 13, 2014
1. Babe Ruth 206
4. Lou Gehrig 179, MVP, triple crown
6. Mickey Mantle 172, 3 MVP, triple crown
22. Joe DiMaggio 155, 3 MVP
201. Bill Dickey 127
236. Yogi Berra 125, 3 MVP
438. Derek Jeter 117
_________________________________________________
|
Squint and you can see Ruth, Gehrig, DiMaggio, Mantle |
That post also has a detailed comparison between Jeter and Rodriguez based on their career batting numbers. OPS+ for Rodriguez is 143.
Of all the nonsense I heard Wednesday on D-Day (Derek Day retirement announcement) the silliest was to say that Jeter is for his era what Ruth, DiMaggio and Mantle were for theirs. Somehow Gehrig was omitted. Say what? Jeter as a batter was below two catchers, Dickey and Berra, and we all know the physical toll that catching takes.
Jeter's best OPS+ was 153 in 1999. Yankee batters have topped that 64 times; 16 times a Yankee has had at least 201, all by three players: Ruth (10), Gehrig (3) and Mantle (3). DiMaggio's best: 184. Even Bobby Murcer had 181 and 169 in 1971-2. Ruth had the highest: 255. Highest Yankee during the Jeter era: Alex Rodriguez 176.
Let's see how Jeter compares to his teammates. I used OPS+ so that it's easier to compare to Yankees from previous eras. There is a summary below the leaders for individual seasons. It's devastating to the idea that Jeter was a great hitter.
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Bernie Williams | 131 | 1996 | 27 | NYY | AL | 143 | 641 | 551 | 108 | 168 | 26 | 7 | 29 | 102 | 82 | 8 | 72 | 0 | 1 | 7 | 15 | 17 | 4 | .305 | .391 | .535 | .926 | *8/DH |
2 | Paul O'Neill | 123 | 1996 | 33 | NYY | AL | 150 | 660 | 546 | 89 | 165 | 35 | 1 | 19 | 91 | 102 | 8 | 76 | 4 | 0 | 8 | 21 | 0 | 1 | .302 | .411 | .474 | .885 | *9/DH3 |
3 | Tino Martinez | 108 | 1996 | 28 | NYY | AL | 155 | 671 | 595 | 82 | 174 | 28 | 0 | 25 | 117 | 68 | 4 | 85 | 2 | 1 | 5 | 18 | 2 | 1 | .292 | .364 | .466 | .830 | *3/HD |
4 | Derek Jeter | 101 | 1996 | 22 | NYY | AL | 157 | 654 | 582 | 104 | 183 | 25 | 6 | 10 | 78 | 48 | 1 | 102 | 9 | 6 | 9 | 13 | 14 | 7 | .314 | .370 | .430 | .800 | *6 |
5 | Wade Boggs | 98 | 1996 | 38 | NYY | AL | 132 | 574 | 501 | 80 | 156 | 29 | 2 | 2 | 41 | 67 | 7 | 32 | 0 | 1 | 5 | 10 | 1 | 2 | .311 | .389 | .389 | .778 | *5/HD |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Bernie Williams | 147 | 1997 | 28 | NYY | AL | 129 | 591 | 509 | 107 | 167 | 35 | 6 | 21 | 100 | 73 | 7 | 80 | 1 | 0 | 8 | 10 | 15 | 8 | .328 | .408 | .544 | .952 | *8/H |
2 | Tino Martinez | 143 | 1997 | 29 | NYY | AL | 158 | 685 | 594 | 96 | 176 | 31 | 2 | 44 | 141 | 75 | 14 | 75 | 3 | 0 | 13 | 15 | 3 | 1 | .296 | .371 | .577 | .948 | *3/DH |
3 | Paul O'Neill | 137 | 1997 | 34 | NYY | AL | 149 | 637 | 553 | 89 | 179 | 42 | 0 | 21 | 117 | 75 | 8 | 92 | 0 | 0 | 9 | 16 | 10 | 7 | .324 | .399 | .514 | .912 | *9/HD3 |
4 | Derek Jeter | 103 | 1997 | 23 | NYY | AL | 159 | 748 | 654 | 116 | 190 | 31 | 7 | 10 | 70 | 74 | 0 | 125 | 10 | 8 | 2 | 14 | 23 | 12 | .291 | .370 | .405 | .775 | *6 |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Bernie Williams | 160 | 1998 | 29 | NYY | AL | 128 | 578 | 499 | 101 | 169 | 30 | 5 | 26 | 97 | 74 | 9 | 81 | 1 | 0 | 4 | 19 | 15 | 9 | .339 | .422 | .575 | .997 | *8/D |
2 | Paul O'Neill | 130 | 1998 | 35 | NYY | AL | 152 | 672 | 602 | 95 | 191 | 40 | 2 | 24 | 116 | 57 | 2 | 103 | 2 | 0 | 11 | 22 | 15 | 1 | .317 | .372 | .510 | .882 | *9/HD |
3 | Derek Jeter | 127 | 1998 | 24 | NYY | AL | 149 | 694 | 626 | 127 | 203 | 25 | 8 | 19 | 84 | 57 | 1 | 119 | 5 | 3 | 3 | 13 | 30 | 6 | .324 | .384 | .481 | .864 | *6/H |
4 | Tino Martinez | 124 | 1998 | 30 | NYY | AL | 142 | 608 | 531 | 92 | 149 | 33 | 1 | 28 | 123 | 61 | 3 | 83 | 6 | 0 | 10 | 18 | 2 | 1 | .281 | .355 | .505 | .860 | *3/H |
5 | Scott Brosius | 121 | 1998 | 31 | NYY | AL | 152 | 603 | 530 | 86 | 159 | 34 | 0 | 19 | 98 | 52 | 1 | 97 | 10 | 8 | 3 | 4 | 11 | 8 | .300 | .371 | .472 | .843 | *5/3H9 |
6 | Chuck Knoblauch | 102 | 1998 | 29 | NYY | AL | 150 | 706 | 603 | 117 | 160 | 25 | 4 | 17 | 64 | 76 | 1 | 70 | 18 | 2 | 7 | 13 | 31 | 12 | .265 | .361 | .405 | .765 | *4/D |
7 | Chad Curtis | 90 | 1998 | 29 | NYY | AL | 151 | 545 | 456 | 79 | 111 | 21 | 1 | 10 | 56 | 75 | 3 | 80 | 7 | 1 | 6 | 11 | 21 | 5 | .243 | .355 | .360 | .714 | *78H/9D |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Derek Jeter | 153 | 1999 | 25 | NYY | AL | 158 | 739 | 627 | 134 | 219 | 37 | 9 | 24 | 102 | 91 | 5 | 116 | 12 | 3 | 6 | 12 | 19 | 8 | .349 | .438 | .552 | .989 | *6 |
2 | Bernie Williams | 149 | 1999 | 30 | NYY | AL | 158 | 697 | 591 | 116 | 202 | 28 | 6 | 25 | 115 | 100 | 17 | 95 | 1 | 0 | 5 | 11 | 9 | 10 | .342 | .435 | .536 | .971 | *8/HD |
3 | Chuck Knoblauch | 118 | 1999 | 30 | NYY | AL | 150 | 715 | 603 | 120 | 176 | 36 | 4 | 18 | 68 | 83 | 0 | 57 | 21 | 3 | 5 | 7 | 28 | 9 | .292 | .393 | .454 | .848 | *4 |
4 | Chili Davis | 108 | 1999 | 39 | NYY | AL | 146 | 554 | 476 | 59 | 128 | 25 | 1 | 19 | 78 | 73 | 7 | 100 | 2 | 0 | 3 | 12 | 4 | 1 | .269 | .366 | .445 | .812 | *DH |
5 | Paul O'Neill | 107 | 1999 | 36 | NYY | AL | 153 | 675 | 597 | 70 | 170 | 39 | 4 | 19 | 110 | 66 | 1 | 89 | 2 | 0 | 10 | 24 | 11 | 9 | .285 | .353 | .459 | .812 | *9/H |
6 | Tino Martinez | 104 | 1999 | 31 | NYY | AL | 159 | 665 | 589 | 95 | 155 | 27 | 2 | 28 | 105 | 69 | 7 | 86 | 3 | 0 | 4 | 14 | 3 | 4 | .263 | .341 | .458 | .800 | *3/H |
7 | Scott Brosius | 84 | 1999 | 32 | NYY | AL | 133 | 529 | 473 | 64 | 117 | 26 | 1 | 17 | 71 | 39 | 2 | 74 | 6 | 2 | 9 | 13 | 9 | 3 | .247 | .307 | .414 | .722 | *5/HD |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Bernie Williams | 140 | 2000 | 31 | NYY | AL | 141 | 616 | 537 | 108 | 165 | 37 | 6 | 30 | 121 | 71 | 11 | 84 | 5 | 0 | 3 | 15 | 13 | 5 | .307 | .391 | .566 | .957 | *8/DH |
2 | Jorge Posada | 139 | 2000 | 28 | NYY | AL | 151 | 624 | 505 | 92 | 145 | 35 | 1 | 28 | 86 | 107 | 10 | 151 | 8 | 0 | 4 | 11 | 2 | 2 | .287 | .417 | .527 | .943 | *23/HD |
3 | Derek Jeter | 128 | 2000 | 26 | NYY | AL | 148 | 679 | 593 | 119 | 201 | 31 | 4 | 15 | 73 | 68 | 4 | 99 | 12 | 3 | 3 | 14 | 22 | 4 | .339 | .416 | .481 | .896 | *6 |
4 | Paul O'Neill | 92 | 2000 | 37 | NYY | AL | 142 | 628 | 566 | 79 | 160 | 26 | 0 | 18 | 100 | 51 | 2 | 90 | 0 | 0 | 11 | 17 | 14 | 9 | .283 | .336 | .424 | .760 | *9/DH |
5 | Tino Martinez | 89 | 2000 | 32 | NYY | AL | 155 | 632 | 569 | 69 | 147 | 37 | 4 | 16 | 91 | 52 | 9 | 74 | 8 | 0 | 3 | 16 | 4 | 1 | .258 | .328 | .422 | .749 | *3/H |
6 | Scott Brosius | 70 | 2000 | 33 | NYY | AL | 135 | 519 | 470 | 57 | 108 | 20 | 0 | 16 | 64 | 45 | 1 | 73 | 2 | 0 | 2 | 17 | 0 | 3 | .230 | .299 | .374 | .673 | *5/3HD79 |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Bernie Williams | 139 | 2001 | 32 | NYY | AL | 146 | 633 | 540 | 102 | 166 | 38 | 0 | 26 | 94 | 78 | 11 | 67 | 6 | 0 | 9 | 15 | 11 | 5 | .307 | .395 | .522 | .917 | *8/HD |
2 | Derek Jeter | 124 | 2001 | 27 | NYY | AL | 150 | 686 | 614 | 110 | 191 | 35 | 3 | 21 | 74 | 56 | 3 | 99 | 10 | 5 | 1 | 13 | 27 | 3 | .311 | .377 | .480 | .858 | *6 |
3 | Jorge Posada | 118 | 2001 | 29 | NYY | AL | 138 | 557 | 484 | 59 | 134 | 28 | 1 | 22 | 95 | 62 | 10 | 132 | 6 | 0 | 5 | 10 | 2 | 6 | .277 | .363 | .475 | .838 | *2/DH3 |
4 | Tino Martinez | 114 | 2001 | 33 | NYY | AL | 154 | 635 | 589 | 89 | 165 | 24 | 2 | 34 | 113 | 42 | 2 | 89 | 2 | 0 | 2 | 12 | 1 | 2 | .280 | .329 | .501 | .830 | *3/HD |
5 | Paul O'Neill | 105 | 2001 | 38 | NYY | AL | 137 | 563 | 510 | 77 | 136 | 33 | 1 | 21 | 70 | 48 | 4 | 59 | 2 | 0 | 3 | 20 | 22 | 3 | .267 | .330 | .459 | .789 | *9/DH |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Jason Giambi | 172 | 2002 | 31 | NYY | AL | 155 | 689 | 560 | 120 | 176 | 34 | 1 | 41 | 122 | 109 | 4 | 112 | 15 | 0 | 5 | 18 | 2 | 2 | .314 | .435 | .598 | 1.034 | *3D |
2 | Bernie Williams | 141 | 2002 | 33 | NYY | AL | 154 | 699 | 612 | 102 | 204 | 37 | 2 | 19 | 102 | 83 | 7 | 97 | 3 | 0 | 1 | 19 | 8 | 4 | .333 | .415 | .493 | .908 | *8/DH |
3 | Alfonso Soriano | 129 | 2002 | 26 | NYY | AL | 156 | 741 | 696 | 128 | 209 | 51 | 2 | 39 | 102 | 23 | 1 | 157 | 14 | 1 | 7 | 8 | 41 | 13 | .300 | .332 | .547 | .880 | *4/HD |
4 | Jorge Posada | 121 | 2002 | 30 | NYY | AL | 143 | 598 | 511 | 79 | 137 | 40 | 1 | 20 | 99 | 81 | 9 | 143 | 3 | 0 | 3 | 23 | 1 | 0 | .268 | .370 | .468 | .837 | *2/HD |
5 | Robin Ventura | 119 | 2002 | 34 | NYY | AL | 141 | 562 | 465 | 68 | 115 | 17 | 0 | 27 | 93 | 90 | 9 | 101 | 2 | 0 | 5 | 14 | 3 | 1 | .247 | .368 | .458 | .826 | *5H/3 |
6 | Derek Jeter | 111 | 2002 | 28 | NYY | AL | 157 | 730 | 644 | 124 | 191 | 26 | 0 | 18 | 75 | 73 | 2 | 114 | 7 | 3 | 3 | 14 | 32 | 3 | .297 | .373 | .421 | .794 | *6/D |
Provided by Baseball-Reference.com: View Play Index Tool Used
Generated 2/13/2014.
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Jason Giambi | 148 | 2003 | 32 | NYY | AL | 156 | 690 | 535 | 97 | 134 | 25 | 0 | 41 | 107 | 129 | 9 | 140 | 21 | 0 | 5 | 9 | 2 | 1 | .250 | .412 | .527 | .939 | *3D/H |
2 | Jorge Posada | 144 | 2003 | 31 | NYY | AL | 142 | 588 | 481 | 83 | 135 | 24 | 0 | 30 | 101 | 93 | 6 | 110 | 10 | 0 | 4 | 13 | 2 | 4 | .281 | .405 | .518 | .922 | *2/HD |
3 | Alfonso Soriano | 126 | 2003 | 27 | NYY | AL | 156 | 734 | 682 | 114 | 198 | 36 | 5 | 38 | 91 | 38 | 7 | 130 | 12 | 0 | 2 | 8 | 35 | 8 | .290 | .338 | .525 | .863 | *4/H |
4 | Derek Jeter | 125 | 2003 | 29 | NYY | AL | 119 | 542 | 482 | 87 | 156 | 25 | 3 | 10 | 52 | 43 | 2 | 88 | 13 | 3 | 1 | 10 | 11 | 5 | .324 | .393 | .450 | .844 | *6/H |
5 | Hideki Matsui | 109 | 2003 | 29 | NYY | AL | 163 | 695 | 623 | 82 | 179 | 42 | 1 | 16 | 106 | 63 | 5 | 86 | 3 | 0 | 6 | 25 | 2 | 2 | .287 | .353 | .435 | .788 | *78/DH |
6 | Bernie Williams | 107 | 2003 | 34 | NYY | AL | 119 | 521 | 445 | 77 | 117 | 19 | 1 | 15 | 64 | 71 | 8 | 61 | 3 | 0 | 2 | 21 | 5 | 0 | .263 | .367 | .411 | .778 | *8/DH |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Gary Sheffield | 141 | 2004 | 35 | NYY | AL | 154 | 684 | 573 | 117 | 166 | 30 | 1 | 36 | 121 | 92 | 7 | 83 | 11 | 0 | 8 | 16 | 5 | 6 | .290 | .393 | .534 | .927 | *9D/5 |
2 | Hideki Matsui | 137 | 2004 | 30 | NYY | AL | 162 | 680 | 584 | 109 | 174 | 34 | 2 | 31 | 108 | 88 | 2 | 103 | 3 | 0 | 5 | 11 | 3 | 0 | .298 | .390 | .522 | .912 | *7/8 |
3 | Jorge Posada | 131 | 2004 | 32 | NYY | AL | 137 | 547 | 449 | 72 | 122 | 31 | 0 | 21 | 81 | 88 | 5 | 92 | 9 | 0 | 1 | 24 | 1 | 3 | .272 | .400 | .481 | .881 | *2H |
4 | Alex Rodriguez | 131 | 2004 | 28 | NYY | AL | 155 | 698 | 601 | 112 | 172 | 24 | 2 | 36 | 106 | 80 | 6 | 131 | 10 | 0 | 7 | 18 | 28 | 4 | .286 | .375 | .512 | .888 | *5/6 |
5 | Derek Jeter | 114 | 2004 | 30 | NYY | AL | 154 | 721 | 643 | 111 | 188 | 44 | 1 | 23 | 78 | 46 | 1 | 99 | 14 | 16 | 2 | 19 | 23 | 4 | .292 | .352 | .471 | .823 | *6 |
6 | Bernie Williams | 108 | 2004 | 35 | NYY | AL | 148 | 651 | 561 | 105 | 147 | 29 | 1 | 22 | 70 | 85 | 5 | 96 | 2 | 1 | 2 | 19 | 1 | 5 | .262 | .360 | .435 | .795 | *8D/H |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Alex Rodriguez | 173 | 2005 | 29 | NYY | AL | 162 | 715 | 605 | 124 | 194 | 29 | 1 | 48 | 130 | 91 | 8 | 139 | 16 | 0 | 3 | 8 | 21 | 6 | .321 | .421 | .610 | 1.031 | *5/6D |
2 | Jason Giambi | 161 | 2005 | 34 | NYY | AL | 139 | 545 | 417 | 74 | 113 | 14 | 0 | 32 | 87 | 108 | 5 | 109 | 19 | 0 | 1 | 7 | 0 | 0 | .271 | .440 | .535 | .975 | *3D/H |
3 | Gary Sheffield | 137 | 2005 | 36 | NYY | AL | 154 | 675 | 584 | 104 | 170 | 27 | 0 | 34 | 123 | 78 | 7 | 76 | 8 | 0 | 5 | 11 | 10 | 2 | .291 | .379 | .512 | .891 | *9D/H |
4 | Hideki Matsui | 130 | 2005 | 31 | NYY | AL | 162 | 704 | 629 | 108 | 192 | 45 | 3 | 23 | 116 | 63 | 7 | 78 | 3 | 0 | 8 | 16 | 2 | 2 | .305 | .367 | .496 | .863 | *78D/9H |
5 | Derek Jeter | 125 | 2005 | 31 | NYY | AL | 159 | 752 | 654 | 122 | 202 | 25 | 5 | 19 | 70 | 77 | 3 | 117 | 11 | 7 | 3 | 15 | 14 | 5 | .309 | .389 | .450 | .839 | *6/HD |
6 | Jorge Posada | 109 | 2005 | 33 | NYY | AL | 142 | 546 | 474 | 67 | 124 | 23 | 0 | 19 | 71 | 66 | 5 | 94 | 2 | 0 | 4 | 8 | 1 | 0 | .262 | .352 | .430 | .782 | *2H/D |
7 | Robinson Cano | 106 | 2005 | 22 | NYY | AL | 132 | 551 | 522 | 78 | 155 | 34 | 4 | 14 | 62 | 16 | 1 | 68 | 3 | 7 | 3 | 16 | 1 | 3 | .297 | .320 | .458 | .778 | *4/H |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Jason Giambi | 148 | 2006 | 35 | NYY | AL | 139 | 579 | 446 | 92 | 113 | 25 | 0 | 37 | 113 | 110 | 12 | 106 | 16 | 0 | 7 | 10 | 2 | 0 | .253 | .413 | .558 | .971 | *D3/H |
2 | Alex Rodriguez | 134 | 2006 | 30 | NYY | AL | 154 | 674 | 572 | 113 | 166 | 26 | 1 | 35 | 121 | 90 | 8 | 139 | 8 | 0 | 4 | 22 | 15 | 4 | .290 | .392 | .523 | .914 | *5/HD |
3 | Derek Jeter | 132 | 2006 | 32 | NYY | AL | 154 | 715 | 623 | 118 | 214 | 39 | 3 | 14 | 97 | 69 | 4 | 102 | 12 | 7 | 4 | 13 | 34 | 5 | .343 | .417 | .483 | .900 | *6/D |
4 | Robinson Cano | 126 | 2006 | 23 | NYY | AL | 122 | 508 | 482 | 62 | 165 | 41 | 1 | 15 | 78 | 18 | 3 | 54 | 2 | 1 | 5 | 19 | 5 | 2 | .342 | .365 | .525 | .890 | *4/DH |
5 | Jorge Posada | 122 | 2006 | 34 | NYY | AL | 143 | 545 | 465 | 65 | 129 | 27 | 2 | 23 | 93 | 64 | 1 | 97 | 11 | 0 | 5 | 10 | 3 | 0 | .277 | .374 | .492 | .867 | *2H/D3 |
6 | Johnny Damon | 115 | 2006 | 32 | NYY | AL | 149 | 671 | 593 | 115 | 169 | 35 | 5 | 24 | 80 | 67 | 1 | 85 | 4 | 2 | 5 | 4 | 25 | 10 | .285 | .359 | .482 | .841 | *8D/H3 |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Alex Rodriguez | 176 | 2007 | 31 | NYY | AL | 158 | 708 | 583 | 143 | 183 | 31 | 0 | 54 | 156 | 95 | 11 | 120 | 21 | 0 | 9 | 15 | 24 | 4 | .314 | .422 | .645 | 1.067 | *5/D |
2 | Jorge Posada | 153 | 2007 | 35 | NYY | AL | 144 | 589 | 506 | 91 | 171 | 42 | 1 | 20 | 90 | 74 | 7 | 98 | 6 | 0 | 3 | 18 | 2 | 0 | .338 | .426 | .543 | .970 | *2H/D3 |
3 | Hideki Matsui | 123 | 2007 | 33 | NYY | AL | 143 | 634 | 547 | 100 | 156 | 28 | 4 | 25 | 103 | 73 | 2 | 73 | 3 | 0 | 10 | 9 | 4 | 2 | .285 | .367 | .488 | .855 | *7D |
4 | Derek Jeter | 121 | 2007 | 33 | NYY | AL | 156 | 714 | 639 | 102 | 206 | 39 | 4 | 12 | 73 | 56 | 3 | 100 | 14 | 3 | 2 | 21 | 15 | 8 | .322 | .388 | .452 | .840 | *6/H |
5 | Robinson Cano | 119 | 2007 | 24 | NYY | AL | 160 | 669 | 617 | 93 | 189 | 41 | 7 | 19 | 97 | 39 | 5 | 85 | 8 | 1 | 4 | 19 | 4 | 5 | .306 | .353 | .488 | .841 | *4/H |
6 | Bobby Abreu | 113 | 2007 | 33 | NYY | AL | 158 | 699 | 605 | 123 | 171 | 40 | 5 | 16 | 101 | 84 | 0 | 115 | 3 | 0 | 7 | 11 | 25 | 8 | .283 | .369 | .445 | .814 | *9/HD |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Alex Rodriguez | 150 | 2008 | 32 | NYY | AL | 138 | 594 | 510 | 104 | 154 | 33 | 0 | 35 | 103 | 65 | 9 | 117 | 14 | 0 | 5 | 16 | 18 | 3 | .302 | .392 | .573 | .965 | *5/D |
2 | Jason Giambi | 128 | 2008 | 37 | NYY | AL | 145 | 565 | 458 | 68 | 113 | 19 | 1 | 32 | 96 | 76 | 5 | 111 | 22 | 0 | 9 | 6 | 2 | 1 | .247 | .373 | .502 | .876 | *3D/H |
3 | Bobby Abreu | 120 | 2008 | 34 | NYY | AL | 156 | 684 | 609 | 100 | 180 | 39 | 4 | 20 | 100 | 73 | 2 | 109 | 1 | 0 | 1 | 14 | 22 | 11 | .296 | .371 | .471 | .843 | *9/HD |
4 | Johnny Damon | 118 | 2008 | 34 | NYY | AL | 143 | 623 | 555 | 95 | 168 | 27 | 5 | 17 | 71 | 64 | 0 | 82 | 1 | 2 | 1 | 5 | 29 | 8 | .303 | .375 | .461 | .836 | *78D/H3 |
5 | Derek Jeter | 102 | 2008 | 34 | NYY | AL | 150 | 668 | 596 | 88 | 179 | 25 | 3 | 11 | 69 | 52 | 0 | 85 | 9 | 7 | 4 | 24 | 11 | 5 | .300 | .363 | .408 | .771 | *6/D |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Mark Teixeira | 141 | 2009 | 29 | NYY | AL | 156 | 707 | 609 | 103 | 178 | 43 | 3 | 39 | 122 | 81 | 9 | 114 | 12 | 0 | 5 | 13 | 2 | 0 | .292 | .383 | .565 | .948 | *3/DH |
2 | Alex Rodriguez | 138 | 2009 | 33 | NYY | AL | 124 | 535 | 444 | 78 | 127 | 17 | 1 | 30 | 100 | 80 | 7 | 97 | 8 | 0 | 3 | 13 | 14 | 2 | .286 | .402 | .532 | .933 | *5/DH |
3 | Derek Jeter | 125 | 2009 | 35 | NYY | AL | 153 | 716 | 634 | 107 | 212 | 27 | 1 | 18 | 66 | 72 | 4 | 90 | 5 | 4 | 1 | 18 | 30 | 5 | .334 | .406 | .465 | .871 | *6/DH |
4 | Hideki Matsui | 123 | 2009 | 35 | NYY | AL | 142 | 528 | 456 | 62 | 125 | 21 | 1 | 28 | 90 | 64 | 1 | 75 | 4 | 0 | 2 | 4 | 0 | 1 | .274 | .367 | .509 | .876 | *DH |
5 | Nick Swisher | 122 | 2009 | 28 | NYY | AL | 150 | 607 | 498 | 84 | 124 | 35 | 1 | 29 | 82 | 97 | 2 | 126 | 3 | 3 | 6 | 13 | 0 | 0 | .249 | .371 | .498 | .869 | *93/7HD1 |
6 | Robinson Cano | 121 | 2009 | 26 | NYY | AL | 161 | 674 | 637 | 103 | 204 | 48 | 2 | 25 | 85 | 30 | 2 | 63 | 3 | 0 | 4 | 22 | 5 | 7 | .320 | .352 | .520 | .871 | *4/H |
7 | Johnny Damon | 118 | 2009 | 35 | NYY | AL | 143 | 626 | 550 | 107 | 155 | 36 | 3 | 24 | 82 | 71 | 1 | 98 | 2 | 2 | 1 | 9 | 12 | 0 | .282 | .365 | .489 | .854 | *7/HD |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Robinson Cano | 141 | 2010 | 27 | NYY | AL | 160 | 696 | 626 | 103 | 200 | 41 | 3 | 29 | 109 | 57 | 14 | 77 | 8 | 0 | 5 | 19 | 3 | 2 | .319 | .381 | .534 | .914 | *4/DH |
2 | Nick Swisher | 129 | 2010 | 29 | NYY | AL | 150 | 635 | 566 | 91 | 163 | 33 | 3 | 29 | 89 | 58 | 0 | 139 | 6 | 3 | 2 | 13 | 1 | 2 | .288 | .359 | .511 | .870 | *9D/H38 |
3 | Mark Teixeira | 124 | 2010 | 30 | NYY | AL | 158 | 712 | 601 | 113 | 154 | 36 | 0 | 33 | 108 | 93 | 6 | 122 | 13 | 0 | 5 | 15 | 0 | 1 | .256 | .365 | .481 | .846 | *3/DH |
4 | Alex Rodriguez | 123 | 2010 | 34 | NYY | AL | 137 | 595 | 522 | 74 | 141 | 29 | 2 | 30 | 125 | 59 | 1 | 98 | 3 | 0 | 11 | 7 | 4 | 3 | .270 | .341 | .506 | .847 | *5D/H |
5 | Curtis Granderson | 108 | 2010 | 29 | NYY | AL | 136 | 528 | 466 | 76 | 115 | 17 | 7 | 24 | 67 | 53 | 3 | 116 | 2 | 4 | 3 | 3 | 12 | 2 | .247 | .324 | .468 | .792 | *8H |
6 | Brett Gardner | 105 | 2010 | 26 | NYY | AL | 150 | 569 | 477 | 97 | 132 | 20 | 7 | 5 | 47 | 79 | 1 | 101 | 5 | 5 | 3 | 6 | 47 | 9 | .277 | .383 | .379 | .762 | *78/HD |
7 | Derek Jeter | 90 | 2010 | 36 | NYY | AL | 157 | 739 | 663 | 111 | 179 | 30 | 3 | 10 | 67 | 63 | 4 | 106 | 9 | 1 | 3 | 22 | 18 | 5 | .270 | .340 | .370 | .710 | *6/DH |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Curtis Granderson | 142 | 2011 | 30 | NYY | AL | 156 | 691 | 583 | 136 | 153 | 26 | 10 | 41 | 119 | 85 | 0 | 169 | 12 | 4 | 7 | 12 | 25 | 10 | .262 | .364 | .552 | .916 | *8/HD |
2 | Robinson Cano | 133 | 2011 | 28 | NYY | AL | 159 | 681 | 623 | 104 | 188 | 46 | 7 | 28 | 118 | 38 | 11 | 96 | 12 | 0 | 8 | 18 | 8 | 2 | .302 | .349 | .533 | .882 | *4/DH |
3 | Mark Teixeira | 121 | 2011 | 31 | NYY | AL | 156 | 684 | 589 | 90 | 146 | 26 | 1 | 39 | 111 | 76 | 3 | 110 | 11 | 0 | 8 | 12 | 4 | 1 | .248 | .341 | .494 | .835 | *3/DH |
4 | Nick Swisher | 120 | 2011 | 30 | NYY | AL | 150 | 635 | 526 | 81 | 137 | 30 | 0 | 23 | 85 | 95 | 6 | 125 | 5 | 1 | 8 | 18 | 2 | 2 | .260 | .374 | .449 | .822 | *93/DH |
5 | Derek Jeter | 100 | 2011 | 37 | NYY | AL | 131 | 607 | 546 | 84 | 162 | 24 | 4 | 6 | 61 | 46 | 0 | 81 | 6 | 4 | 5 | 10 | 16 | 6 | .297 | .355 | .388 | .743 | *6D |
6 | Brett Gardner | 92 | 2011 | 27 | NYY | AL | 159 | 588 | 510 | 87 | 132 | 19 | 8 | 7 | 36 | 60 | 1 | 93 | 8 | 8 | 2 | 5 | 49 | 13 | .259 | .345 | .369 | .713 | *78/H |
Rk | Player | OPS+ | Year | Age | Tm | Lg | G | PA | AB | R | H | 2B | 3B | HR | RBI | BB | IBB | SO | HBP | SH | SF | GDP | SB | CS | BA | OBP | SLG | OPS | Pos |
1 | Robinson Cano | 148 | 2012 | 29 | NYY | AL | 161 | 697 | 627 | 105 | 196 | 48 | 1 | 33 | 94 | 61 | 10 | 96 | 7 | 0 | 2 | 22 | 3 | 2 | .313 | .379 | .550 | .929 | *4/DH |
2 | Nick Swisher | 125 | 2012 | 31 | NYY | AL | 148 | 624 | 537 | 75 | 146 | 36 | 0 | 24 | 93 | 77 | 2 | 141 | 4 | 1 | 5 | 9 | 2 | 3 | .272 | .364 | .473 | .837 | *93D/H |
3 | Curtis Granderson | 115 | 2012 | 31 | NYY | AL | 160 | 684 | 596 | 102 | 138 | 18 | 4 | 43 | 106 | 75 | 4 | 195 | 5 | 1 | 7 | 5 | 10 | 3 | .232 | .319 | .492 | .811 | *8/HD |
4 | Mark Teixeira | 115 | 2012 | 32 | NYY | AL | 123 | 524 | 451 | 66 | 113 | 27 | 1 | 24 | 84 | 54 | 1 | 83 | 7 | 0 | 12 | 11 | 2 | 1 | .251 | .332 | .475 | .807 | *3/DH |
5 | Derek Jeter | 114 | 2012 | 38 | NYY | AL | 159 | 740 | 683 | 99 | 216 | 32 | 0 | 15 | 58 | 45 | 1 | 90 | 5 | 6 | 1 | 24 | 9 | 4 | .316 | .362 | .429 | .791 | *6D |
6 | Alex Rodriguez | 111 | 2012 | 36 | NYY | AL | 122 | 529 | 463 | 74 | 126 | 17 | 1 | 18 | 57 | 51 | 3 | 116 | 10 | 0 | 5 | 13 | 13 | 1 | .272 | .353 | .430 | .783 | *5D/H |
Here is the brutal summary that exposes Jeter as a consistently good but not great hitter.
year | Yankee Leader | OPS+ | Jeter OPS+ | Jeter rank |
1996 | Bernie Williams | 131 | 101 | 4 |
1997 | Bernie Williams | 147 | 103 | 4 |
1998 | Bernie Williams | 160 | 127 | 3 |
1999 | Derek Jeter | 153 | 153 | 1 |
2000 | Bernie Williams | 140 | 128 | 3 |
2001 | Bernie Williams | 139 | 124 | 2 |
2002 | Jason Giambi | 172 | 111 | 6 |
2003 | Jason Giambi | 148 | 125 | 4 |
2004 | Gary Sheffield | 141 | 114 | 5 |
2005 | Alex Rodriguez | 173 | 125 | 5 |
2006 | Jason Giambi | 149 | 132 | 3 |
2007 | Alex Rodriguez | 176 | 121 | 4 |
2008 | Alex Rodriguez | 150 | 102 | 5 |
2009 | Mark Teixeira | 141 | 125 | 3 |
2010 | Robinson Cano | 141 | 90 | 7 |
2011 | Curtis Granderson | 142 | 100 | 5 |
2012 | Robinson Cano | 148 | 114 | 5 |
| average | 150 | 117 | 4 |
In 18 seasons Jeter was the best Yankee hitter once. ONCE! I find that shocking. During his own era Jeter was not the best hitter on his own team. Generally,
Jeter was number four ... on his own team. How much could Jeter have possibly been needed?
3,316 hits?
Pete Rose had 940 (28%) more.
Who is the best hitter Jeter is better than?
Fielding? As a Yankee fan I always liked Jeter's fielding. I often defended him against other Yankee fans who criticized Jeter unmercifully. However, the people who claim to understand the various and evolving fielding metrics evaluate Jeter as below average. I'm tired of fighting. With the game on the line I trusted Jeter more than any other shortstop to retire the batter on a routine ground ball. That might sound like faint praise but "late and close" is a situation used to evaluate batters, so why not for fielders, too?
Derek Jeter is not a great hitter or fielder. So, how can he be a great player? I don't have a good answer. But I'd vote for him for the Hall of Fame. He's a Yankee and I like him. That's my view as a fan.
4 comments:
The answer to the question of who the best hitter that Jeter is better than is Eddie Mathews. Mathews had 93.5 oWAR while Jeter has 94.0. Jeter just needs a barely productive season to pass Jimmie Foxx for 20th place all-time.
Rather than disparaging Jeter's career -- as seems to be the author's intent -- this post actually underscore just how impressive it really was. When a shortstop is consistently one of the best or better hitters on an offensively loaded team, that's really saying a lot.
oWAR is a total. Longevity usually provides a higher total. Divide oWAR by Plate Appearances to get perspective instead of mindlessly staring at totals, which would result in Pete Rose being the best hitter since he has the most hits.
oWAR includes base running. The issue was hitting. OPS+:
Eddie Mathews: 143
Derek Jeter: 115
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